Apr 22, 2025 Caroline County Commissioners Meeting

[00:02:33]

ALL RIGHT. OKAY. GOOD MORNING, EVERYONE, AND WELCOME TO THE APRIL 22ND, 2025 CAROLINE COUNTY COMMISSIONER MEETING, WHICH IS NOW IN ORDER. THIS MORNING WE HAVE OUR INVOCATION BY REVEREND BUDDY DUNN OF FAITH FELLOWSHIP CHURCH OF PRESTON.

AND THAT'LL BE FOLLOWED BY THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.

SO IF EVERYONE COULD PLEASE RISE. PASTOR DUNN, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

FATHER, WE THANK YOU AGAIN FOR THE GATHERING TODAY TO HANDLE THE ADMINISTRATIVE PARTS OF THE COUNTY.

[Call to Order: Invocation, Rev. Buddy Dunn, Faith Fellowship Church of Preston; Pledge of Allegiance; Agenda Review]

WE ASK IS THE PROCEDURES CAN CONTINUE, THAT YOU WOULD GIVE THAT WISDOM AND UNDERSTANDING TO THEM.

THEY'RE HELPERS TO BRING THE INFORMATION TO THEM AND GOD THAT YOU WOULD GET THE GLORY OUT OF WHAT WE DO, THANK YOU FOR YOUR BLESSINGS ON US. IN THE NAME OF JESUS WE PRAY.

AMEN. AMEN. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.

OH, THANK YOU, REVEREND DUNN, FOR TAKING TIME OUT OF THIS BEAUTIFUL TUESDAY MORNING.

THANK YOU. YEAH, SITTING IN THIS ROOM WITH US.

DURING THE APRIL 15TH MEETING, THE BOARD HELD A CLOSED SESSION TO DISCUSS ONGOING LITIGATION RELATED TO ANIMAL CONTROL AND TO CONDUCT INTERVIEW FOR

[President’s Closed Session Report Out]

THE ATTENDEES INCLUDED THE COMMISSIONERS STEWART BARROLL, KIM RAEDER, KATHLEEN FREEMAN, DANIEL FOX, JENNIFER REIBLY, AND CRYSTAL DADDS. OKAY. WE'LL NOW HAVE OUR OPENING PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD. IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK THIS MORNING? OKAY.

[Public Comment]

[00:05:08]

[Steve Hurlock, Communications Division Chief, Department of Emergency Services]

[Special Presentation of Caroline County Telecommunicator of the Year]

SIT HERE FOR JUST A MINUTE. I ACTUALLY PRESENTED MICHELLE WITH THE AWARD ON FRIDAY, BECAUSE THAT WAS ALMOST AT THE END OF THE TELECOMMUNICATOR WEEK FOR THIS YEAR.

SHE HAS BEEN A DEDICATED EMPLOYEE FOR OVER 21 YEARS.

THIS PAST YEAR WAS NO DIFFERENT. SHE STEPS UP WHEN WE ASK HER TO.

SHE HAS BEEN AN ACTING SHIFT SUPERVISOR NUMEROUS TIMES ON HER SHIFT WHEN HER SUPERVISOR IS OUT.

SHE'S ALSO OUR TAC AND I'M NOT SURE WHAT THAT ACTUALLY STANDS FOR, BUT IT TAKES CARE OF OUR NCIC RELATED.

IT'S KIND OF A COORDINATOR FOR ANYTHING NCIC RELATED, WHICH IS NATIONAL CRIMINAL INTELLIGENCE CENTER.

SHE ALSO TRIES TO ATTEND AS MUCH TRAINING AS POSSIBLE.

SOMETHING GOES UP ON THE BOARD THAT, YOU KNOW, FOR THE STAFF.

SHE'S READY TO SIGN UP AND DOES HER PART. SO WE WANTED TO RECOGNIZE HER THIS YEAR AS THE TELECOMMUNICATOR OF THE YEAR FOR CAROLINE COUNTY EMERGENCY SERVICES. ALL RIGHT. WELL, CONGRATULATIONS. THANK YOU.

SO HAVE YOU BEEN HOW LONG IN CAROLINE? 22 YEARS.

JANUARY 2003 WAS MY HIRE DATE. YOU WERE HERE WHEN IT WAS EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT.

WHEN IT WAS IN THE BASEMENT OF THE JAIL. YES, ABSOLUTELY.

IF PEOPLE WANT TO TALK ABOUT YOU KNOW, CONDITIONS, THEN, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD HAVE BEEN DOWN THERE.

SO. ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY. [LAUGHTER] I MEAN, THAT'S I'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT BEFORE.

SO YEAH, MICHELLE'S SHE'S SEEN 3 OR 4 DIFFERENT COMMUNICATIONS MANAGERS, 3 OR 4 DIRECTORS.

SO SHE SEES AND THEN THROUGH ALL THE CHANGES AND RADIO SYSTEMS AND, YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING ELSE, SHE SAID, YOU KNOW, ALL THOSE CHANGES OVER THAT, THAT TIME PERIOD.

SO AND WORKED HER WAY THROUGH IT. YEAH. WHEN I FIRST GOT HIRED, WE HAD THE PUSH BUTTON ALERT TIME.

SO THERE'S THAT. A LOT, LOT DIFFERENT. YOU HAD THE TARPS IN THE BASEMENT OF THE [LAUGHTER] SO.

WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR EVERYTHING DURING THOSE DURING THOSE TIMES.

IT'S YOU KNOW, I KIND OF THINK I SAID LAST WEEK IT'S UNIMAGINABLE THE THINGS I KNOW THAT YOU'VE HEARD AND LISTENED TO AND THOUGHT ABOUT AND DEALT WITH OVER THE YEARS. SO THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. IS THIS YOUR FIRST TIME RECEIVING THE AWARD IN 22 YEARS? I DON'T KNOW. I MEAN, LIKE, WE REALLY DIDN'T.

DIDN'T HAVE THE AWARD. IT'S RELATIVELY NEW. WE DIDN'T HAVE THE AWARD FOR A LONG TIME.

BUT, YEAH, WE STARTED EIGHT YEARS AGO. OKAY. DOING THIS DURING TELECOMMUNICATOR WEEK.

GOTCHA. YEAH. SO, YEAH, SHE'S THE EIGHTH RECIPIENT OF THIS AWARD.

THERE MAY HAVE BEEN SOMETHING BEFORE I CAME. I MEAN, IT'S BEEN 18 YEARS FOR ME, BUT.

YEAH, I DON'T REMEMBER ANY YEAH. HOW MANY DO WE HAVE IN THE COUNTY? DO YOU KNOW? TELECOMMUNICATORS. THERE'S 16 FULL TIME. 17 FULL TIME.

AND THEN WE HAVE TWO PART TIME. OKAY. THANK YOU, MICHELLE, FOR BEING HERE FOR CAROLINE COUNTY FOR ALL THEM YEARS.

THANK YOU. SO, I MEAN, I'M SURE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'VE BEEN HERE 21 YEARS AND YOU'VE TALKED TO PEOPLE AND ALL 21 YEARS, YOU PROBABLY CAN'T EVEN COUNT HOW MANY PEOPLE YOU TALK TO. OH, NO. ABSOLUTELY NOT. AND I CAN'T EVEN COUNT HOW MANY I TALKED TO YESTERDAY.

YEAH, I'M JUST SAYING. [LAUGHTER] AND, YOU KNOW, YOU DEDICATED 21 YEARS HERE, AND THAT'S A FEAT BEYOND ITSELF.

YEAH. SO IT'S LIKE, YOU KNOW, YOU'VE TALKED TO PEOPLE AND YOU'VE PROBABLY SEEN THEM ON STREET. YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW WHO THEY ARE. AND. OH, YEAH. YOU KNOW, AND YOU JUST SEEM LIKE TO ME, I GUESS YOU WOULD. YOU SEEM LIKE TO ME LIKE YOU'RE A LOW PROFILE PERSON ANYWAY, JUST BY YOUR DEMEANOR.

SO. BUT I APPRECIATE YOU FOR BEING HERE FOR CAROLINE COUNTY.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT. ARE WE GETTING A PICTURE OR.

ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. YEAH. SHAKE YOUR HEAD. YES.

[INAUDIBLE] THAT'S UP TO YOU.

CONGRATULATIONS.

[00:10:13]

THANK YOU. ALRIGHT. LAST ONE. ONE MORE. SMILE BIG.

THANK YOU, THANK YOU MICHELLE.

ALL RIGHT. I'M GOING TO SKIP OVER THE PROCLAMATION FOR RIGHT NOW.

YEAH. THAT'S FINE. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SKIP OVER THE PROCLAMATION AND MOVE ON TO OUR LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

[Legislative Session: Frist Reading and Introduction]

[• Emergency Legislative Bill #2025-005, Chapter 175—Zoning –Article XIX—Planning Commission - §§ C and E of § 175–163. Eliminating Term Limits]

AYE. AYE. OKAY. RENOWNED LEGISLATIVE SESSION AND MR. BARROLL. I BELIEVE WE HAVE A LEGISLATIVE BILL 2025-005.

REGARDING THE PLANNING COMMISSION ELIMINATING THE TERM LIMITS.

YES, SIR. YOU ARE CORRECT. WE ARE HERE FOR THE INTRODUCTION AND FIRST READING OF LEGISLATIVE BILL NUMBER 2025-005, CHAPTER 175, ZONING ARTICLE 19, PLANNING COMMISSION, SUBSECTIONS C AND E OF SECTION 175-163 . THE PURPOSE OF THIS BILL BASICALLY IS TO REPEAL AND REENACT WITH AMENDMENTS THOSE TWO SUBSECTIONS C, WHICH IS TERM, AND E, WHICH IS REMOVAL OF MEMBERS OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION.

FOR THE PURPOSE OF ELIMINATING TERM LIMITS FOR MEMBERS OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION, SIMILARLY TO WHAT WE DID RECENTLY WITH THE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS, WE ARE ALSO MODIFYING LANGUAGE OF SUBSECTION E TO CONFORM TO CHANGES IN THE ANNOTATED CODE OF MARYLAND, WHICH CONCERNS SUSPENSION AND REMOVAL OF MEMBERS OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION.

AND WE MAKE THIS ACT AN EMERGENCY BILL. AS I SAID, THE BILL IS BEING INTRODUCED TODAY.

IT IS SCHEDULED FOR PUBLICATION OF A NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING IN THE STAR DEMOCRAT ON THE 10TH OF MAY.

THE PUBLIC HEARING WILL BE ON THE 13TH OF MAY.

THAT WILL BE THE SECOND READING AND THE PUBLIC HEARING. THE THIRD READING IS SCHEDULED FOR THE 20TH OF MAY.

AS AN EMERGENCY BILL, IT WOULD BECOME EFFECTIVE THE DATE IT IS PASSED.

OKAY. I BELIEVE WE HAVE ALL RELATIVELY NEW APPOINTEES ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION, RIGHT? THE ONLY JEFF JACKSON, I THINK, IS THE ONLY MEMBER WHO HAS PROBABLY SERVED A PREVIOUS TERM.

I BELIEVE. DO YOU RECALL THE CURRENT CODE IS TWO FIVE YEAR TERMS? IS THAT CORRECT? YES, SIR. OKAY. AND THE TERM IS ESTABLISHED IN STATE STATUTE. IT IS FIVE YEARS. OKAY. SO IT BASICALLY JUST RETURNS THE DISCRETION TO THE COMMISSIONERS WHETHER TO REAPPOINT SOMEONE TO A THIRD TERM OR NOT, AS OPPOSED TO LIMITING OUR ABILITY TO REAPPOINT.

EXACTLY. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. ANY QUESTIONS? FURTHER DISCUSSION.

I HAVE NO QUESTIONS. NO. OKAY. I WOULD MAKE A MOTION THAT WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THE PROPOSED SCHEDULE AS LAID OUT BY MR. BARROLL AND MOVE TO A, I GUESS, A PUBLIC HEARING, SECOND READING.

PUBLIC HEARING. YES, SIR. AS SCHEDULED. SECOND.

OKAY. MOTION AND SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

AYE. AYE. OKAY. THE AYES HAVE IT. I BELIEVE THAT CONCLUDES OUR LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

I MOVE, WE RETURN TO OPEN SESSION. REGULAR SESSION.

OKAY. SECOND. MOTION TO SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

AYE. AYE. THE AYES HAVE IT. MOVING ON TO OUR CONSENT AGENDA.

ANY QUESTIONS, CONCERNS OR COMMENTS ABOUT ANYTHING ON THE CONSENT AGENDA?

[Consent Agenda]

YEP. I MOVE, WE APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA. SECOND.

[00:15:02]

AYE. AYE. AYE. OKAY. THE AYES HAVE IT. COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR'S REPORT.

[County Administrator’s Report]

I'LL JUST MENTION THAT SHERRY BRATTON, YOUR HR DIRECTOR, AND I ARE CONTINUING TO MEET WITH ALL OF THE EMPLOYEES ABOUT THE HEALTH INSURANCE AND ANYTHING ELSE THAT'S ON THEIR MIND. WHAT WE ARE FINDING ACTUALLY IS ALL POSITIVE NEWS.

THE THE SELF-INSURED RATE LOOKS REALLY GOOD. EMPLOYEES HAVE ALMOST UNIVERSALLY SHARED THE SAME OPINION, WHICH WE'LL GET INTO WHEN WE GIVE YOU THE PRESENTATION.

BUT GENERALLY SPEAKING, I THINK THAT THE HEALTH INSURANCE SITUATION WILL BE A MUCH BETTER OUTLOOK AFTER WE MAKE THIS CHANGE AND MUCH BETTER FOR THE COUNTY AND OUR BUDGET AND THE EMPLOYEES GOING FORWARD. SO THAT'S GOOD. AND THEN JUST THE OTHER THING I'LL MENTION THE SECOND EDUCATIONAL SPECS COMMITTEE IS THIS EVENING, SO I'LL BE ATTENDING THAT AND I'LL CONTINUE TO GIVE YOU AN UPDATE.

AND ALSO TONIGHT IS THE ACC MEETING TO GO OVER THE ORDINANCE AND PROVIDE YOU BACK WITH COMMENTS.

SO SOMEHOW I'M GOING TO MULTITASK THIS. THAT'S ALL I HAVE.

OKAY. ALL RIGHT. COUNTY COMMISSIONER, OPEN DISCUSSION PERIOD.

[County Commissioners Open Discussion Period]

ARE WE? IS THAT ON THIS ON A FUTURE AGENDA? DO WE HAVE I SENT AN EMAIL TO MS. PIERCE TO HAVE HER ON, AND I HAVE NOT RECEIVED A RESPONSE.

OKAY. AND WE, TO MY KNOWLEDGE, HAVE NOT WELL, WITHOUT DANNY HERE, I DON'T KNOW, BUT WE WERE ASKING FOR SOME CLARIFICATION.

STILL FROM THE OFFICE. I DON'T KNOW IF THEY DID RESPOND TO MEET WITH HIM TO SPEAK ON THAT, BUT I DON'T THINK HE'S RECEIVED THE CLARIFICATION. ALL RIGHT. THAT'S ALL I HAVE, COMMISSIONER BARTZ.

OH, WHILE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT CANNABIS MONEY I SPOKE WITH SCOTT WARNER FROM MITCHELL REGIONAL COUNCIL, AND THEY MIGHT NEED. THEY'RE NOT SURE YET, BUT THEY MIGHT NEED SOME FUNDS FOR THEIR MIDDLE SCHOOL ENRICHMENT PROGRAM, WHICH IS IN THE SUMMER. I TALKED TO DANNY. HE SAID IT.

IT PROBABLY WOULD FALL UNDER THAT CATEGORY FOR FUNDING.

AND SCOTT WOULD GIVE US, IF IT NEEDED TO COME THAT FAR, SCOTT WOULD GIVE US AN ACCOUNTING OF THE CAROLINE COUNTY KIDS AND AN AMOUNT THAT WOULD COVER THOSE IN NEED, NOT JUST ANY KIDS.

SO THAT'S JUST SOMETHING TO BE DETERMINED. HE'S NOT QUITE SURE YET, BUT HE, YOU KNOW, IF HE WANTS TO GET ANYTHING AT ALL, BUT. WELL, I THINK THAT'S I THINK THAT'S WHAT MY CONCERN IS THAT IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE REQUESTS FOR IT, WE NEED TO REALLY LET PEOPLE KNOW HOW TO GO ABOUT REQUESTING IT SO THAT WE CAN, YOU KNOW, REVIEW THOSE REQUESTS BECAUSE THE MONEY'S THERE.

AND, I MEAN, WE REALLY SHOULD START MOVING ON THIS.

I MEAN, YEAH, I KNOW THE LOCAL MANAGEMENT BOARD IS GOING TO GIVE $25,000 TOWARDS IT.

I THINK THE OVERALL GOAL, I THINK THEY NEED $150,000, BUT I THINK LOCAL MANAGEMENT BOARD IS GOING TO GIVE 25.

BUT NOT SURE WHAT THE BOARD OF ED IS GOING TO IF THEY'RE GOING TO GIVE UP ANY OR NOT.

SO, YOU KNOW, HE MIGHT NEED SOME. IT'S CAROLINE DORCHESTER AND TALBOT COUNTY KIDS AND IT'S MIDDLE SCHOOL.

SO THAT WOULD BE TO BE DETERMINED. SO I JUST WANT TO, YOU KNOW, THAT IS SOMETHING WE COULD POSSIBLY SPEND SOME CANNABIS MONEY ON THAT AS WELL.

OKAY. SO THAT'S ALL I GOT. OKAY. FOLLOWING UP FROM LAST WEEK'S, I BELIEVE IT WAS LAST TUESDAY'S MEETING. REGARDING THE DRAINAGE ISSUES OUT ON HANNAH HENRY WAY.

I BELIEVE LESLIE HAS A MEETING WITH ROBIN AND DAVE EDWARDS LATER THIS WEEK.

THURSDAY OUT AT HANNAH HENRY WAY TO WALK THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD TO LOOK AT THE GROWTH IN THE DITCHES THAT DRAIN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. TO GET A SCOPE OF WORK TOGETHER AND GET AN IDEA OF WHAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE TO CLEAN THE MAIN DRAINAGE DITCH OUT.

REMOVE THE, I GUESS, THE TREES, VEGETATION, THAT KIND OF STUFF.

HAVE YOU HAD ANY SUCCESS REACHING OUT TO PROPERTY OWNERS? AND LESLIE'S HANDLED THAT, AND. OKAY. I WANT TO SAY SHE SAID, LIKE, FOUR OF THE PROPERTIES WERE OWNED BY THE SAME PERSON,

[00:20:01]

OKAY. GOOD. GOOD. PERMISSION TO GO ACROSS THE BOARD.

OKAY. SO IT'S OUR BELIEF THAT THERE'S A DRAINAGE SWALE THAT CROSSES PRIVATE PROPERTY THAT DRAINS THAT NEIGHBORHOOD.

AND IT'S JUST BEEN GROWN UP, NEGLECTED, NOT MOWED OR MAINTAINED.

SO WE BELIEVE THAT'S RESTRICTING THE WATER FLOW AWAY AND CAUSING SOME OF THE FLOODING DURING THE RAIN EVENTS.

SO HOPEFULLY THAT'LL ALLEVIATE THOSE ISSUES IF WE CAN GET THAT TAKEN CARE OF.

LAST WEEK I DID HAVE A MEETING. NORTH COUNTY WATER AND SEWER MEETING.

WITH ALL THE REPRESENTATIVES. AND WE DISCUSSED OPTIONS MOVING FORWARD FOR THOSE MUNICIPALITIES IN THE NORTH END OF THE COUNTY TO SOLVE THEIR SEWER ISSUES.

WE DO HAVE A LOT OF ADDITIONAL FAILING SEPTICS UP THERE THAT ARE BEING CONVERTED TO TO HOLDING TANKS.

AND I JUST I THINK WE SHOULD PROBABLY HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT WHERE THE COMMISSIONERS FEEL LIKE WE ARE WILLING TO GO FROM HERE.

THEY BASICALLY HAVE TWO OVERALL OPTIONS. ONE WOULD BE TO CONTINUE KIND OF ON THE PATH OF CONNECTING TO GREENSBORO'S WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT.

AND ESSENTIALLY UNDER THE CURRENT AGREEMENT, THOSE MUNICIPALITIES REALLY DON'T HAVE ANY SAY IN THE OPERATION OF THE PLANT.

THE RATES THAT THEY PAY OR ANY REAL INPUT INTO THE MAINTENANCE OPERATION AND THEY'RE KIND OF JUST SILENT RATEPAYERS.

THEY DON'T GET TO ELECT THEY DON'T GET A VOTE FOR THE TOWN COUNCIL OF GREENSBORO.

SO THERE'S REALLY THERE'S REALLY NO LEVERAGE FOR THEM, AND THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF CONCERN ON THEIR PART.

IN CONTINUING TO GO THAT PATH. THEY WOULD LIKE TO INVESTIGATE SETTING UP LET'S SAY OPTION TWO WOULD BE TO SET UP THEIR OWN WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT AT THE NORTH END OF THE COUNTY.

NOW, INSIDE OF THAT OPTION, THERE ARE MULTIPLE DIFFERENT PATHS OR SCENARIOS THAT WE COULD GO DOWN.

EACH WE DISCUSSED EACH INDIVIDUAL TOWN HAVING THEIR OWN SYSTEM OR PLANT WHICH WE BELIEVE IS PROBABLY COST PROHIBITIVE AND WOULD PUT THEM IN A SITUATION WHERE THEY WOULD ALL BE COMPETING WITH OPERATORS OR COMPETING TO FIND AN OPERATOR TO OPERATE THE PLANT FOR THEM. WE ALSO THE PLANTS, INDIVIDUAL PLANTS FOR THEM.

WE ALSO DISCUSSED OPTION WHERE THERE WAS ONE PLANT TO SERVICE ALL THREE TOWNS HENDERSON, MARYDEL AND TEMPLEVILLE. AND WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE WOULD EITHER BE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF AN AUTHORITY OR THE COUNTY POTENTIALLY STEPPING IN AND MANAGING THE PLANT FOR THEM.

SO MY QUESTION IS, IS WHAT, YOU KNOW, JUST THROWING THIS ALL OUT THERE FOR YOU GUYS TO THINK ABOUT? I GUESS WE DON'T NEED AN ANSWER RIGHT NOW, BUT IS IT TIME THAT CAROLINE COUNTY GOT INTO THE WATER AND SEWER BUSINESS OR START TO START TO INVESTIGATE THAT? WE'RE ALREADY IN THE WATER BUSINESS AT JONESTOWN.

WE'RE PROBABLY THE ONLY COUNTY ON THE SHORE THAT DOES NOT HAVE SOME TYPE OF SEWER SYSTEM THAT WE OPERATE.

I KNOW IT'S PROBABLY A CONTROVERSIAL DECISION.

BECAUSE WE HAVE MADE IT THIS LONG WITHOUT HAVING THAT RESPONSIBILITY.

BUT I THINK IN ORDER FOR US TO HAVE ANY INFLUENCE OVER FUTURE DEVELOPMENT AND REALLY WHAT THE COUNTY LOOKS LIKE WHERE DEVELOPMENT TAKES PLACE, I THINK IT'S PROBABLY TIME THAT WE STEP IN AND OCCUPY THAT TERRITORY BY STARTING OUR, YOU KNOW, TO MANAGE OUR OWN PLANT SOMEWHERE.

NOT ONLY IN THE NORTH END OF THE COUNTY, BUT POTENTIALLY WEST DENTON.

AND I BELIEVE IT'S PROBABLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE WE HAVE OTHER SMALL RURAL VILLAGES THAT START TO EXPERIENCE THE SAME ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES THAT THAT

[00:25:01]

I THINK AS ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATIONS BECOME MORE STRICT AND WE BECOME MORE AND MORE EDUCATED ON THE EFFECTS OF POTENTIAL HEALTH HAZARDS, YOU KNOW, WITH WITH SEPTICS, THAT IS PROBABLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE WE HAVE ISSUES IN OTHER RURAL VILLAGES AROUND THE COUNTY THAT MAY NEED TO BE ADDRESSED.

SO. WELL, I THINK. YOU KNOW, IT'S I GUESS IT'S DISAPPOINTING THAT THE NORTH COUNTY OPERATION HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR SOME TIME.

YOU KNOW, ONE THING THAT I THINK WE DO NOT WANT TO GET INVOLVED IN IS DEALING WITH TOWNS SETTING THEIR WATER AND SEWER RATES. I MEAN, THAT'S A PREROGATIVE FOR THE LOCAL JURISDICTION, BUT IT'S.

WOULD ONE ALTERNATIVE BE TO SEE I MEAN, IF I'M IF I'M CORRECT AND I DON'T KNOW THIS EXACTLY, BUT I THINK THAT, LIKE, GREENSBORO HAS A UTILITY COMMISSION THAT SETS RATES OR MAKES RECOMMENDATION TO THE TO THE MAYOR AND COUNCIL.

I DON'T THINK THEY HAVE THAT ANYMORE. I COULD BE WRONG.

SO THE MAYOR AND COUNCIL JUST SETS THE RATES? I THINK SO, WITHOUT ANY INPUT. ALL RIGHT. WELL I CAN CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND THE PROBLEM WITH YOU KNOW, JUST ARBITRARY RATE INCREASES FOR PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE ANY SAY IN IT.

BUT I DON'T KNOW. I MEAN, YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT.

WELL, I THINK THE AGREEMENT DOES HAVE SOME PROTECTIONS.

I DON'T WANT TO I DON'T WANT TO SAY THAT THE AGREEMENT DIDN'T PROVIDE SOME LEVEL OF PROTECTION.

I DON'T THINK THAT THE TOWN OF GREENSBORO COULD CHARGE ANY MORE.

SO. SO THE PEOPLE IN THE THAN THEY CHARGE. IN THE UNINCORPORATED AREAS ARE PAYING THE SAME AMOUNT AS THE PEOPLE IN TOWN.

IS THAT I THINK SO? OKAY. WELL, I MEAN, THEY'RE TIED TOGETHER.

YEAH. BUT I MEAN, THE THING IS, IS IF THE PLANT IS NOT MANAGED PROPERLY AND THEREFORE THE COST TO OPERATE THE PLANT IS HIGHER. THE ADJOINING JURISDICTIONS DO NOT HAVE ANY CONTROL OR SAY IN HOW THEY FIX THE OPERATION OF THE PLANT.

YOU KNOW SO AND I THINK AS TIME PASSES, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE FORGOTTEN THAT THIS AGREEMENT ALSO BAILED OUT THE TOWN OF GREENSBORO, WHO WAS IN A REALLY BAD SPOT WITH THEIR PLANT FLOODING.

THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE TO BORROW A LOT OF MONEY TO MOVE THAT PLANT, AND THEY COULD HAVE SEEN EXORBITANT RATE HIKES IN THE TOWN OF GREENSBORO TO PAY BACK THE THE DEBTS THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN INCURRED BECAUSE OF THE MOVING OF THAT PLANT.

SO, BECAUSE GOLDSBORO WAS UNDER A CONSENT ORDER TO FIX ITS FAILING SEPTIC ISSUE THERE WAS SUBSTANTIAL FUNDING AVAILABLE, BOTH STATE AND FEDERAL TO COVER THE COST OF A NEW PLANT.

SO IT WAS A WIN WIN FOR BOTH GOLDSBORO AND GREENSBORO AND POTENTIALLY THE MUNICIPALITIES FURTHER TO THE NORTH WHEN FUNDING BECAME AVAILABLE FOR THEM TO HOOK UP AS WELL. SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, WITH ANYTHING, THE FURTHER THAT THE MORE TIME THAT PASSES BETWEEN THE ORIGINAL AGREEMENT, THE MORE THE RUMOR MILL STARTS TO TURN.

AND. OH, WELL, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ACTUALLY HELPING GREENSBORO AND WE'RE SUBSIDIZING OR WE'RE ACTUALLY HELPING GOLDSBORO.

WE'RE SUBSIDIZING GOLDSBORO SEWER THROUGH THE TOWN OF GREENSBORO.

AND EVERYBODY, YOU KNOW, HAS FORGOTTEN THAT GREENSBORO WAS REALLY, REALLY IN A BAD SPOT.

AND IT WAS MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL FOR EVERYONE. SO AND I THINK THE PERSON WE REALLY NEED IN ON THIS CONVERSATION IS LESLIE, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, SHE WAS THE ONE WHO KIND OF PULLED THIS TOGETHER.

AND THERE WERE SEVERAL GIVE AND TAKES THERE. GREENSBORO IN ORDER TO BE ABLE TO YOU KNOW, TO HAVE THAT PLAN. AND I THINK IT'S AN ENR PLAN. IN ORDER TO DO THAT, THEY HAD TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, THEY HAD TO DETERMINE WHERE REVENUE WAS GOING TO COME FROM.

AND IT BENEFITED THE TOWN TO HAVE ADDITIONAL REVENUE COMING IN FROM THE UNINCORPORATED AREAS, FROM THE PEOPLE IN GOLDSBORO. AND OBVIOUSLY THE PEOPLE IN GOLDSBORO BENEFITED BECAUSE THE PLANT WAS THERE AND SERVED THEM.

SO, I MEAN, I JUST, YOU KNOW, LOOK, I DON'T KNOW ALL THE DETAILS ABOUT THE MANAGEMENT OF THE PLANT.

[00:30:05]

OR THEY WERE TOLD IT WAS GOING TO 119, AND IT WAS AT 119 FOR ONE MONTH.

AND THEN IT GOT RECALCULATED AND WENT TO 129.

AND THEY A MONTH AND THEY JUST WHAT I WAS TOLD WAS THE EXPLANATION WAS THAT THEY DID THE MATH WRONG AND IT SHOULD HAVE WENT TO 129. THEY MESSED UP, REALIZED A MONTH LATER AND JUMPED IT UP ANOTHER TEN BUCKS TO 129.

NOW, THE AGREEMENT DOES SAY THAT THE TOWN OF GREENSBORO HAS TO GIVE THE TOWN OF GOLDSBORO 30 DAYS NOTICE.

AND THERE WERE SOME BACK AND FORTH OVER, YOU KNOW, WHEN THE ACTUAL NOTIFICATION WAS GIVEN I BELIEVE GREENSBORO ACTUALLY HAD TO DELAY THE RATE INCREASE ONE MONTH BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T GIVE A MONTH'S NOTICE.

BUT, I MEAN, A MONTH'S NOTICE TO GO FROM 77 TO 119 THAT'S THAT'S A BACK BREAKER FOR A LOT OF RESIDENTS UP THERE.

AND THEN TO SAY, OH, WE DID THE MATH WRONG. IT'S ACTUALLY 129.

YEAH. YOU KNOW, IF THAT STORY IS THAT'S WHAT I WAS TOLD.

SO I HAVEN'T TALKED TO GREENSBORO ABOUT BUT THIS IS JUST, YOU KNOW, THE DISCUSSION THAT WE HAD BETWEEN.

RIGHT. BECAUSE GOLDSBORO IS NO LONGER A MEMBER OF THE NORTH COUNTY WATER AND SEWER, AND NEITHER IS GREENSBORO, BECAUSE THEY'RE BOTH HOOKED UP. WHEN THEY BECAME WHEN THEY CONNECTED, THEY CAME OFF THE NORTH COUNTY WATER AND SEWER.

SO IT'S JUST TEMPLEVILLE, MARYDEL, HENDERSON AND THE COUNTY.

SO. WELL, THE QUESTION I WOULD HAVE WOULD BE, WHICH WOULD BE PRETTY SIMPLE, I GUESS, FOR THE PHONE CALL WOULD BE IS THE SAME RATE BEING CHARGED TO OUTSIDE PEOPLE OUTSIDE TOWN THAT IS BEING CHARGED INSIDE TOWN? BECAUSE, TO BE HONEST, IT'S NOT UNUSUAL FOR MUNICIPALITIES TO CHARGE ADDITIONAL FOR OUTSIDE TOWN USERS.

I THINK, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, IN SOME TOWNS HERE THEY CHARGE THREE TIMES THE AMOUNT I IMAGINE IN TOWN OF GREENSBORO THEY ARE ON TOWN WATER, SO IT'S METERED. NORMALLY YOUR SEWER CHARGE IS TACKED ON TO YOUR WATER RATE BECAUSE THEY TRACK THE GALLONS.

BUT IN GOLDSBORO IT'S ON WELLS, SO THEY DON'T HAVE ANY WAY TO METER IT.

SO THEY JUST FLAT CHARGE. SO I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S A WAY TO DO A DIRECT COMPARISON.

YEAH I WOULD THINK THAT THEY'RE I DON'T KNOW, IT'S BEEN A LONG TIME SINCE I'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN ANY OF THIS, BUT NORMALLY THERE'S A WATER AND SEWER CHARGE.

AND KEEP IN MIND THAT THE RATES THAT ARE CHARGED FROM MY RECOLLECTION, WHERE YOU BORROW WHEN YOU BORROW THE MONEY BECAUSE THERE HAD TO BE SOME MONEY BORROWED TO PUT THAT PLAN IN WHOEVER AND USUALLY THE ENTITY THAT THAT MONEY IS BORROWED FROM IS USDA.

AND I THINK THAT USDA IS INVOLVED IN GREENSBORO, BECAUSE I REMEMBER MANY YEARS AGO GOING TO THE GROUNDBREAKING FOR THAT PLANT AND USDA WAS THERE TO SPEAK. USDA T HEY WILL BE A VERY LARGE DETERMINING FACTOR IN WHAT THE RATES ARE GOING TO BE, BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO REQUIRE YOU TO CHARGE RATES THAT ARE GOING TO COVER YOUR DEBT SERVICE.

SO A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE THAT, YOU KNOW, THE WATER AND SEWER RATES IN THESE TOWNS USED TO BE I'M NOT SAYING NOW I DON'T BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW, BUT USED TO BE DETERMINED BY USDA SAYING, YOU'VE GOT THIS MUCH DEBT SERVICE TO COVER, YOU NEED TO COLLECT AT LEAST THIS MUCH MONEY.

ROBIN, YOU'RE SHAKING YOUR HEAD YES. YOU NEED TO COLLECT THIS MUCH MONEY TO SERVICE THE DEBT YOU HAVE WITH US.

SO HERE'S WHAT YOUR RATES ARE GOING TO HAVE TO BE A MINIMUM OF WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO BE.

IF YOU WANT TO CHARGE ABOVE THAT, YOU CAN. YES. SO I MEAN, I'M TALKING ABOUT STUFF HERE THAT I'M JUST GOING BY RECOLLECTION.

THERE'S NOT THERE WAS NO REQUIREMENT BY USDA FOR THEM TO JUMP.

OKAY. IT WAS TOTALLY THEY HAD TO SWITCH OPERATORS OF THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, AND THE NEW OPERATOR WAS MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE THAN THE PREVIOUS. AND THEY HAD TO DO THAT BECAUSE THE PRIOR OPERATOR HAD THEM IN VIOLATION WITH MDE, SO THEY HAD NO CHOICE. SO IT'S NOT A SITUATION WHERE USDA, NO, USDA DID NOT COME IN AND MAKE THEM DO.

THERE IS NO UTILITY COMMISSION IN GREENSBORO.

OKAY. WELL, EITHER. SO MY I'M CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, WILLING TO TALK ABOUT.

BUT, YOU KNOW, MY CONCERN IS IF WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT AN EXPONENTIAL JUMP IN COSTS AND START OPERATING A WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, YOU'RE GOING TO YOU KNOW, THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT BALLGAME. I MEAN, THE ONLY WAY I WOULD ENTERTAIN IT IS IF THE PEOPLE CONNECTED COVERED THE COST TO OPERATE IT AND ALL OF THAT MATH,

[00:35:06]

AND IF IT'S NOT COST EFFECTIVE, IF THERE'S NOT ENOUGH GRANT MONEY THAT CAN BE OBTAINED, THEN, YOU KNOW, WE YOU KNOW, IT'S TOUGH TO GO BUT BUT I WOULD WANT I WOULDN'T WANT TO SUBSIDIZE IT WITH ANY MONEY FROM THE REST OF THE COUNTY. SIMILAR TO THE CONVERSATION WE HAD ABOUT JONESTOWN, ABOUT INCREASING THE WATER BILL, YOU KNOW, TO COVER THE ACTUAL COST TO OPERATE, THAT I THINK THAT I THINK THAT IF IT BENEFITS YOU AND YOUR RESIDENTS, THEN YOU SHOULD COVER THE COST ASSOCIATED WITH THAT SERVICE THAT IS PROVIDED.

NOW, THE STRUGGLE IS, IS WHAT EACH TOWN, YOU KNOW, STRUGGLES WITH, WHICH IS NO ONE WANTS TO RAISE RATES.

YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE WE DON'T WANT TO SIT HERE AND RAISE TAXES. NO MUNICIPALITY WANTS TO RAISE THE WATER AND SEWER BILL BECAUSE THAT'S CONTROVERSIAL, RIGHT? AND YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOWHERE FOR US TO HIDE.

THERE'S REALLY NOWHERE FOR AN ELECTED OFFICIAL IN A TOWN TO GO HIDE WHEN IT COMES TO RUNNING INTO CONSTITUENTS.

AND YOU GOT TO EXPLAIN WHY DID WE HAVE TO RAISE YOUR WATER AND SEWER BILL? AND I THINK A LOT OF THESE MUNICIPALITIES MAYBE ARE HESITANT TO DO SO, AND IT PUTS THEM IN A DIFFICULT POSITION WHEN IT COMES TO MAINTENANCE AND RECOVERING THE COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH OPERATING THESE PLANTS, BECAUSE DO THEY HAVE THE POLITICAL WILL OR THE FORTITUDE TO BITE THE BULLET AND SAY, HEY, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY'S WATER AND SEWER IS GOING UP AND, AND DEAL WITH THE REPERCUSSIONS OF THAT, YOU KNOW, SO IT WOULD PUT THE COMMISSIONERS IN A POSITION WHERE WE WOULD HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, RAISE RATES EVERY YEAR IN ORDER OR, YOU KNOW, CORRESPONDING WITH INCREASES IN COST TO OPERATE A PLANT LIKE THAT.

SO IT I MEAN THAT THAT PART WOULD MAKE IT A LOT MORE DIFFICULT FOR US IF WE WERE GOING TO STICK TO THE GAME PLAN OR THE PREMISE THAT ANYONE CONNECTED WOULD PAY THE WAY, YOU KNOW, THAT WE WOULDN'T BE SUBSIDIZING WITH TAXPAYER DOLLARS FROM HARMONY OR DENTON OR WHEREVER ELSE. BUT HOW MANY, RATEPAYERS DO WE HAVE? DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW MANY RATEPAYERS WE HAVE IN GOLDSBORO? I WANT TO SAY IT WAS AROUND 70, 70 SOME. AND HENDERSON WAS KIND OF GOING TO BE ON A DIFFERENT LEVEL BECAUSE THEY HAVE A WATER TOWER, RIGHT? I MEAN, I THINK IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, THE HENDERSON WAS GOING TO BE KIND OF A UNIQUE SITUATION BECAUSE THEY HAVE A CENTRAL WATER SYSTEM. YEAH, BUT THEY DO. BUT I DON'T THINK IT AFFECTED IT DIDN'T.

I DON'T THINK IT'S METER. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S METERED THEIR WATER SYSTEM.

BUT I DON'T THINK IT AFFECTED THE CONNECTION TO THE SEWER.

I DID GET THIS GREENSBORO. SO CHARGE GOLDSBORO RATES COMPARABLE TO THE RATES IT CHARGES SYSTEM USERS LOCATED IN GREENSBORO FOR WASTEWATER DISPOSAL. GREENSBORO WILL PROVIDE GOLDSBORO WITH AT LEAST 21 DAYS WRITTEN NOTICE OF ANY SCHEDULED PUBLIC HEARING ON WATER OR ON SEWER RATES.

THAT'S IN THEIR AGREEMENT. YEAH. AND WILL IDENTIFY GOLDSBORO CITIZENS AS SYSTEM USERS IN ANY PUBLIC HEARING ADVERTISING.

WELL, I GUESS AND. SO IT GIVES THEM AN OPPORTUNITY.

BUT I DON'T THINK THAT HAPPENED. NO, THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

AND THERE'S ALSO ONE OTHER THING I WANT TO BRING UP JUST FOR INFORMATION.

GREENSBORO HAS EXPRESSED PREVIOUSLY, AND THIS MIGHT BE ANOTHER QUESTION TO ASK THE LEADERSHIP IN GREENSBORO RIGHT NOW, BUT THEY HAVE EXPRESSED INTERMITTENTLY AND FORMALLY THAT THEY DO NOT WANT TO EXTEND SERVICE TO THE OTHER NORTH COUNTY TOWNS.

SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THEIR OPTION. IT'S NOT WHAT WE INTENDED WHEN WE ORIGINALLY WHEN THE COUNTY HELPED FACILITATE THIS, BUT THEY HAVE AT TIMES IN THE PAST PRETTY STRONGLY SAID THEY'RE NOT GOING TO EXTEND THAT SEWER SERVICE.

WELL, AND SO THEY HAVE A LEGITIMATE THEY HAVE A LEGITIMATE REASON.

SURE. IT'S NOT I DON'T WANT TO MAKE IT SOUND LIKE GREENSBORO IS BEING NON REASONABLE. I DON'T MEAN IT THAT WAY EITHER. NO, BUT JUST TO JUST TO KIND OF ADD A LITTLE CONTEXT, YOU KNOW, THESE GRINDER PUMPS DON'T BREAK AT 2:00 ON WEDNESDAY AFTERNOON, THEY BREAK AT 9:00 SUNDAY NIGHT OR, YOU KNOW, MIDNIGHT FRIDAY NIGHT OR. YOU KNOW.

[00:40:03]

AND THINK ABOUT IT. GREENSBORO WOULD HAVE TO RIDE FROM GREENSBORO, POTENTIALLY TO MARYDEL OR TEMPLEVILLE. LOOK AT THE ISSUE, DETERMINE WHAT IT IS.

HOPE THEY HAD THE PARTS TO FIX IT ON THE TRUCK THAT THEY'RE IN.

IF THEY DIDN'T, MAYBE THEY'D HAVE TO DRIVE ALL THE WAY BACK TO GREENSBORO TO GET THE PARTS AND THEN GO.

I MEAN, IT COULD BE A VERY IT'S AN EXTENSIVE SERVICE FOR A MUNICIPALITY TO TAKE ON BECAUSE, I MEAN, HOW FAR IS IT FROM TEMPLEVILLE TO GREENSBORO? TEN MILES. SO, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT A TYPICAL MUNICIPALITY.

WELL, THE REASON, THE REASON FOR GOLDSBORO BEING ONE OF THE REASONS FOR THEM BEING INCLUDED IN THIS PLAN WAS THAT THEY HAD PROPERTIES THAT WERE UNDER A CONSENT ORDER.

ARE THERE ANY PROPERTIES THAT ARE UNDER CONSENT ORDER FOR SEWAGE IN.

NO. MARYDEL OR HENDERSON. NO. THE DEPARTMENT OF THE ENVIRONMENT HAD A DRAFT CONSENT ORDER FOR ALL OF THE JURISDICTIONS, BUT THEY NEVER FORMALIZED IT. SO THAT WAS THE REASON GOLDSBORO WAS INCLUDED.

IF THE OTHER TOWNS ARE NOT IN UNDER ANY CONSENT ORDER, THEN.

AND I THINK THAT'S PART OF THE REASON THAT GRANT MONEY WAS, WAS GOING TO BE, I'M GUESSING, WAS GOING TO BE AVAILABLE BECAUSE YOU HAD AN AREA THAT WAS UNDER CONSENT.

IF YOU SET UP A SEPARATE WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM FOR 70 USERS, IT WAS 125 EDU'S IN GOLDSBORO.

LESLIE JUST TEXTED ME. MY GUESS WOULD BE YOUR COSTS ARE GOING TO BE AT LEAST EQUAL TO WHAT YOU'RE PAYING NOW.

I DON'T KNOW. I MEAN, I SO THERE'S THERE'S 125 EQUIVALENCY DWELLING UNITS IN GOLDSBORO.

AND THE REASON FOR LIMITING THAT WAS BECAUSE.

SO THAT THIS COULDN'T BE USED FOR DEVELOPMENT. I MEAN, WE WANTED TO SERVE THE PEOPLE WHO HAD FAILING SYSTEMS, CORRECT? KATHLEEN. AND POTENTIALLY A FEW OTHER BUILDABLE LOTS, I THINK WAS THE WAY IT WAS.

IF THERE WERE BUILDABLE LOTS THERE THAT WERE ALREADY RECORDED, YOU WANTED TO YOU WANTED TO PROVIDE CONNECTIONS FOR THEM.

IT WAS NEVER INTENDED TO HAVE SOMEBODY COME IN AND BUY A LARGE PIECE OF PROPERTY AND START SUBDIVIDING IT AND BUILDING.

RIGHT. THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE TO HANDLE THEIR OWN SEWER SYSTEM IF THAT WAS THE PROBLEM.

WELL, THERE'S NO CONNECTION TO THE MAIN LINE BETWEEN THE MUNICIPALITIES ARE NO CONNECTION POINTS.

RIGHT. SO THEY CAN'T CONNECT ANYWAY. I MEAN, THAT GETS INTO I MEAN, NOT TO BROADEN THE WHOLE CONVERSATION, BUT THAT GETS INTO A WHOLE OTHER ISSUE. WE HAVE A NATIONAL, STATE AND LOCAL HOUSING CRISIS, AND THAT IS A DENIED ACCESS POLICY WHERE THE STATE HAD DECIDED WHEN THEY ADOPTED THE SEPTICS LEGISLATION, THE SEPTICS TIERS AND ALL OF THAT, THAT YOU COULDN'T HOOK UP NEW DEVELOPMENT TO THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, ANY NEW WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, EVEN THOUGH THAT WOULD MAKE IT MORE ECONOMICALLY VIABLE TO OPERATE.

WHETHER OR NOT THEY I MEAN, THOSE POLICIES ARE STILL IN PLAY RIGHT NOW, BUT I MEAN, THERE'S A DOWNSIDE TO THAT POLICY ALSO.

SO WE WERE, YOU'RE CORRECT, OBLIGATED TO BUILD THAT, TO SERVE THE NEED, THE FAILING SEPTICS AND A FEW PLACES THAT WE COULD IDENTIFY THAT MIGHT BE HAVING SEPTIC ISSUES ALONG THE WAY. YEAH, THERE ARE.

ONE THING THAT I DID, DIDN'T COME FROM THE MEETING WAS THAT THERE ARE MORE AND MORE FAILING SEPTICS UP THERE ALL THE TIME.

MORE AND MORE HOLDING TANKS, WHICH ARE VERY EXPENSIVE BECAUSE YOU NO LONGER ARE HOLDING TANK.

YOU NO LONGER HAVE A FIELD DRAIN SYSTEM. YOU'RE PUMPING EVERYTHING.

SO YOU'VE GOT TO PAY SOMEONE TO COME IN AND PUMP AND HAUL IT TO A WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT AND DUMP IT.

SO AND I THINK THE CLOSEST ONE IS IN EASTON OR HURLOCK, I THINK ARE THE ONLY TWO AROUND THAT WHERE YOU CAN DUMP NOW.

SO YOU'RE PAYING SOMEONE TO COME PUMP IT AND HAUL IT THERE EVERY.

I DON'T KNOW HOW OFTEN A MONTH, I GUESS FOR ME, AND I'M TALKING ABOUT STUFF HERE THAT I REALLY DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT, BUT WHAT I'M SAYING IS, IF THIS INCREASE WAS PREDICATED BY THE FACT THAT THERE WAS A POORLY RUN SEWER TREATMENT PLANT, THEN MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE, OKAY, GET IT RUN, GET IT RUNNING PROPERLY AND BEING MAINTAINED.

AND THE QUESTION WOULD BE SHOULD GOLDSBORO AS RATE USERS OR SYSTEM USERS, SHOULD THEY BE RESPONSIBLE FOR COVERING, YOU KNOW, FOR PAYING THE COST OF THE POORLY RUN PLANT? AND YOU KNOW, IF THEY GET TO A POINT AND I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THIS, BUT IF THEY GET TO A POINT WHERE THEY HAVE THE PLANT RUNNING PROPERLY, THERE SHOULD BE SOME SAVINGS, YOU KNOW, LOOKED AT THERE.

[00:45:04]

THAT IS A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE OF WHAT YOUR RATES ARE GOING TO BE THAN IF YOU HAVE A PLANT THAT WAS RUN POORLY AND THAT WAS THE REASON FOR THE RATE INCREASE.

THAT'S THE QUESTION. SO, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE GREENSBORO SYSTEM, BUT. WELL, I MEAN, WHAT I UNDERSTAND IS THAT PROSTART WAS RUNNING THE PLANT AND THEY WERE NOT OPERATING IT PROPERLY, AND THE DISCHARGES WERE NOT MEETING THE PERMITTED LIMITS.

AND MDE, YOU KNOW, THREATENED TO FINE. I DON'T KNOW OF ANY FINES WERE ACTUALLY LEVIED OR NOT.

I THINK THERE WAS A FINE LEVIED AND PROSTART COULDN'T GET IT FIXED.

SO THEY HAD TO GO WITH SUSQUEHANNA, WHICH WAS DOUBLE CONTRACTUALLY WHAT PROSTART WAS.

AND YOU JUST CAN'T FIND ANYBODY TO OPERATE THESE PLANTS.

SO, I MEAN, THAT'S HOW. AND THEY'RE IN THE AGREEMENT THERE'S NO OBLIGATION FOR THEM TO SHOW WHY THE RATES ARE CHANGING.

THEY JUST THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO ADVERTISE AND GIVE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR GOLDSBORO'S RESIDENTS TO COMMENT.

THEY DIDN'T DO THAT. THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO GIVE 30 DAYS NOTICE ON A RATE INCREASE.

THEY DIDN'T DO THAT. SO THEY HAD TO DELAY THE RATE INCREASE.

AND I THINK GOLDSBORO IS TRYING TO WORK WITH GREENSBORO AND NOT NECESSARILY PICK A FIGHT HERE.

AND I DON'T I DON'T KNOW WHAT GOLDSBORO RESOURCES ARE TO HIRE AN ATTORNEY AND, YOU KNOW, GO THROUGH.

AND HONESTLY, WHAT DOES THAT GAIN YOU? OTHER THAN BAD BLOOD BETWEEN, YOU KNOW, TWO MUNICIPALITIES.

SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE THREE ENTITIES UP NORTH ARE LOOKING AT THIS LIKE, DOES THIS REALLY LOOK LIKE A GOOD DEAL FOR US? YOU KNOW. AND I CAN'T BLAME THEM. AND TO, YOU KNOW, KATHLEEN'S POINT, DOES GREENSBORO REALLY EVEN WANT TO TAKE ON THAT, THAT OBLIGATION TO MAINTAIN A SYSTEM TEN MILES AWAY FROM THEIR CORPORATE LIMITS? WELL, IF GREENSBORO COMES ALONG AND SAYS WE'RE NOT WE DON'T WANT TO SERVE ANYBODY BEYOND GOLDSBORO, THEN WE GOT A DIFFERENT CONVERSATION WE GOT TO FIGURE OUT.

IF THERE ARE NO FAILING SEPTIC SYSTEMS BEYOND GOLDSBORO OR IF THERE IS NOT A CONSENT ORDER, THEN I THINK THE DECISION HAS TO BE MADE. HOW ARE WE GOING TO PROCEED FROM HERE.

RIGHT. WHICH IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, RIGHT. IS YOU KNOW, DO WE SAY IF YOU ELECT TO SET UP YOUR OWN NORTH, NORTH. I GUESS IT'D BE THE NORTH COUNTY SYSTEM.

YOU KNOW, YOU WOULD HAVE TO STRUCTURE IT IN AN AUTHORITY AND A BOARD CREATED BY THE THREE MUNICIPALITIES.

OR IS THE COUNTY WILLING TO STEP IN AND MANAGE THAT PLAN WHEN IT'S WHEN IT'S UP AND OPERATIONAL? THAT'S WHAT WE'VE GOT TO THINK ABOUT. AND YOU KNOW, IF THEY GO THAT ROUTE AND I REALLY THINK IT'S PROBABLY MOVING IN THAT DIRECTION.

BUT ANYWAY JUST SOMETHING TO KEEP IN THE BACK OF YOUR MIND.

AND THEN WE I THINK THE FOLLOW UP FROM THAT WAS LESLIE AND I WERE GOING TO GO MEET WITH MDE, EXPLORE THESE OPTIONS WITH MDE TO FIND OUT WHAT KIND OF FUNDING WAS AVAILABLE TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE.

AND, YOU KNOW, I COULD POTENTIALLY I COULD REACH OUT TO THE TOWN OF GREENSBORO AND SOMEHOW, I DON'T KNOW, WE SHOULD PROBABLY DRAFT A LETTER AND PROBABLY GET AN OFFICIAL RESPONSE FROM THEM ON WHAT THEIR MAYOR AND COUNCIL'S STANCE CURRENTLY IS ON EVEN EXTENDING TO THE NORTH. YOU THINK? YEAH. IT'S PROBABLY WHAT WE SHOULD DO IS REACH OUT TO THEM AND SAY, YOU KNOW, ARE YOU EVEN INTERESTED? BECAUSE IF THEY'RE NOT, THEN THAT GIVES YOU CLEARER DIRECTION ON WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GO TO ADDRESS THE PROPERTIES BEYOND.

BEYOND. AND I DON'T KNOW IF IN THE AGREEMENT I'M ASSUMING THAT IN THE AGREEMENT THERE IS NO REQUIREMENT FOR GREENSBORO TO EXTEND IT TO THOSE NORTH.

I DON'T KNOW IF THEY HAVE A WAY TO BACK OUT OR IF IT WAS NEVER INCLUDED.

I MEAN, THE MEMBERSHIP OF THE NORTH COUNTY ORGANIZATION HAS CHANGED OVER THE YEARS WITH PEOPLE COMING AND GOING.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, WHO WOULD EVEN HAVE THAT AGREEMENT, I DON'T KNOW.

I GUESS IT WOULD BE RECORDED SOMEWHERE, YOU KNOW, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT WOULD BE.

SO A COUPLE THINGS. DENIED ACCESS POLICY MEANS YOU CAN ONLY CONNECT IF YOU HAVE A FAILING SEPTIC AND YOUR PROPERTY IS TOO SMALL OR YOU HAVE BAD SOIL AND NO OTHER OPTION FOR ON SITE DISPOSAL SYSTEM FOR SEPTIC ESSENTIALLY.

IF THE PLAN IS RUN PROPERLY, THE TOWN COULD GET $35,000 A YEAR FOR MAINTENANCE COSTS.

[00:50:02]

SO THERE'S ONE REPERCUSSION OR EVENT THAT AND THAT $35,000 IS AN ANNUAL GRANT FROM MDE FOR RUNNING AN ENR PLANT EFFICIENTLY.

SO. BUT I DO RECALL THAT THE ALLOWABLE HOOKUPS WERE BASED ON EXISTING SYSTEMS, PLUS BUILDABLE LOTS THAT THEY THOUGHT, YOU KNOW, WERE ALREADY PLOTTED THAT SOMEONE MAY BUILD A HOUSE ON.

THAT'S HOW THEY KIND OF ARRIVED AT THAT NUMBER.

THE OTHER DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS RIGHT NOW? ANYTHING ELSE THERE? THE OTHER THING WAS I GOT AN EMAIL FROM THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE ABOUT BILL SIGNINGS THIS WEEK.

I DID NOT SEE THE SOLAR LEGISLATION ON THE LIST SO FAR.

SO I'M SURE THERE WILL BE WEEKS OF BILL SIGNINGS.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE TIME FRAME IS FOR SIGNING OR NOT.

IS THERE DO YOU KNOW OF ANY LIMIT? THERE IS, I CAN'T REMEMBER.

IT'S LIKE 30 OR 60 DAYS AFTER THE END OF SESSION.

OKAY. AND IF HE DOESN'T SIGN, IT JUST DIES. CORRECT.

OR IT GOES BACK TO. NO. HE CAN LET IT GO INTO EFFECT WITHOUT HIS SIGNATURE.

GOVERNORS HAVE DONE THAT FREQUENTLY. SO THE BILL SIGNING IS A CEREMONIAL.

RIGHT. OKAY. AND THOSE WERE THE TWO THINGS THAT I HAD.

SO I BELIEVE WE HAVE A PROCLAMATION HERE TO DO.

[Proclamation for April 26th, 2025, as Celebrate Trails Day]

OKAY. SO IT'S OKAY. A COUPLE OF THINGS. YOU WERE LATE ANYWAY.

[LAUGHTER] THAT I WILL DO. MAKE SURE YOU GIVE THE PRESS ONE. IT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M DOING, BOSS. EXACTLY WHAT I'M DOING.

IT'S A PLEASURE TO BE BACK HERE. AS A SHAMELESS VOLUNTEER IN THE COMMUNITY.

AND I'M PLEASED TO PRESENT A PROCLAMATION FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION CELEBRATE TRAILS DAY, APRIL 26, 2025. I AM A PART OF A EASTERN SHORE TRAILS NETWORK, A GROUP OF VOLUNTEERS AND POLICY MAKERS FROM THROUGHOUT THE EASTERN SHORE.

AND WE ARE ADVOCATING NOT ONLY FOR EXISTING TRAILS, BUT EXPANDING THAT.

CELEBRATE TRAILS DAY IS A NATIONAL CELEBRATION OF THE VALUE OF TRAILS AND THE OPPORTUNITY NOT ONLY TO HONOR WHAT WE ALREADY HAVE, BUT TO CONSIDER THE VISION TO EXPAND THAT. SO THE OTHER THING IS THIS SATURDAY AFTERNOON FROM 3 TO 5, WE HAVE A CELEBRATE TRAILS EVENT GOING ON AT TUCKAHOE STATE PARK, TAKING ADVANTAGE OF NOT JUST THE EXISTING TRAILS, BUT ALSO LOOKING AT THE VISION FOR EXTENDING THAT TRAIL INTO HILLSBOROUGH, QUEEN ANNE, CORDOVA, THAT TYPE OF A THING.

SO I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU MAY HAVE.

I CAN SEE THE WHEELS TURNING ON COMMISSIONER PORTER'S HEAD.

MAYBE. MAYBE NOT. BUT WITH YOUR PERMISSION, I'D BE HAPPY TO READ THE PROCLAMATION.

I'M SORRY. WHEELS ARE BROKEN IN MY HEAD. OKAY.

[LAUGHTER] BUT WITH YOUR PERMISSION, I'LL READ THE PROCLAMATION INTO THE RECORD.

ABSOLUTELY. ALL RIGHT. WHERE? COMMISSIONER BARTZ.

I READ THE OFFICIAL ONE. OH. ALL RIGHT. WELL, I HAVE THE LARGE TYPE VERSION.

SO. BEEN HERE FOR A WHILE. SO. OH, OKAY. IF THAT IS.

NO. WE EXTEND IT FORWARD TO YOU TO READ THIS.

[LAUGHTER] SINCE YOU WERE LATE. IT'S ALWAYS AN HONOR.

I WAS NOT LATE. I WAS NOT LATE. LET THE RECORD REFLECT I WAS NOT LATE.

WHEREAS THE FOURTH SATURDAY OF APRIL, CELEBRATE TRAILS DAY IS AN ANNUAL SPRING CELEBRATION OF AMERICA'S TRAILS, AN EVENT THAT ENCOURAGES PEOPLE ACROSS THE COUNTRY TO GET OUTSIDE AND ENJOY TRAILS IN THEIR COMMUNITIES AND EXPLORE TRAIL SYSTEMS IN THEIR REGION.

[00:55:04]

WHEREAS CAROLINE COUNTY, IN ASSOCIATION WITH ITS MUNICIPALITIES AND MARYLAND STATE PARKS, SUPPORTS MILES OF TRAILS WITHIN ITS EXISTING PARK SYSTEMS. THESE ELECTED LEADERS ALSO RECOGNIZE THE VALUE OF EXPANDING TRAIL NETWORKS TO CONNECT EXISTING COMMUNITY ASSETS LIKE PARKS, SCHOOLS, AND LIBRARIES TO MUNICIPAL AND RESIDENTIAL CENTERS WITH OFF ROAD TRAILS.

WHEREAS THE EASTERN SHORE REGION HAS FEWER OFF ROAD TRAILS THAN OTHER PARTS OF THE STATE, FOR THE 456,815 RESIDENTS TO ENJOY DAILY AND 7.5 MILLION VISITORS WHO COME HERE FOR OUTDOOR RECREATION AND FUN.

WHEREAS RESIDENTS OF THE EASTERN SHORE RANKED HAVING PLACES TO WALK AND BIKE SAFELY AMONG THEIR TOP PRIORITIES AND LAND PRESERVATION, PARKS AND RECREATION PLANS, AND EXPRESSED SUPPORT FOR BUILDING MORE TRAILS IN THEIR COMMUNITIES AND TOWNS.

WHEREAS THE MARYLAND EASTERN SHORE TRAIL NETWORK IS WORKING WITH COUNTIES, MUNICIPALITIES AND THE STATE TO PLAN AND DEVELOP SAFE FACILITIES SEPARATED FROM VEHICULAR TRAFFIC TO ENCOURAGE BICYCLISTS, WALKERS AND PHYSICALLY CHALLENGED AND OTHER NON-MOTORIZED USERS OF ALL AGES TO BE MORE ACTIVE AND SPEND TIME OUTDOORS, THEREBY IMPROVING THEIR HEALTH, FITNESS, AND HEALTH.

WHEREAS THE MARYLAND EASTERN SHORE TRAIL NETWORK, BY INCREASING ACCESS TO NATURAL, CULTURAL AND HISTORIC SITES, WILL BRING HEALTH AND ECONOMIC BENEFITS TO COUNTIES, MUNICIPALITIES AND BUSINESSES IN THE REGION, SUCH AS REVENUES TO LOCAL ECONOMIES, HEALTH CARE SAVINGS, ENHANCED REAL ESTATE VALUES, AND INCREASED VISITS AND LONGER STAYS BY TOURISTS.

AND WHEREAS CAROLINE COUNTY IS ONE OF EIGHT COUNTIES AND NINE MUNICIPALITIES COMMITTED TO WORK TOWARDS THE SHARED VISION OF CONNECTING PEOPLE AND COMMUNITIES THROUGH A SAFE AND SUSTAINABLE EASTERN SHORE TRAIL NETWORK.

NOW, THEREFORE, WE, THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS FOR CAROLINE COUNTY, DO HEREBY PROCLAIM APRIL 26TH, 2025 AS CELEBRATE TRAILS DAY AND URGE ALL RESIDENTS TO GET OUTSIDE AND ENJOY OUR TRAILS.

AND WE'D LOVE TO HAVE YOUR COMPANY SATURDAY AFTERNOON.

MAYBE. ALL RIGHT, MAYBE NOT. DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? THANK YOU AS ALWAYS, SUE, FOR YOUR COUNTLESS HOURS OF VOLUNTEERING.

WHERE DID YOU SAY IT WAS SATURDAY AFTERNOON? TUCKAHOE STATE PARK, AND IT'LL BE AT THE HEADQUARTERS RIGHT THERE AT THE TRAIL INTERSECTION.

THERE'LL BE ALL KINDS OF IT'S A BIG HORSE RALLY, IF YOU WILL.

THEY HAVE AN OVERNIGHT AT THE EQUESTRIAN CENTER.

SO THEY'LL BE, YOU KNOW, PEDESTRIANS, PEOPLE RIDING HORSES, ALL THAT KIND OF A THING.

SO. YEAH. ALL RIGHT. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. THANKS SO MUCH.

HAVE A GOOD DAY. YOU WANT TO GET A PICTURE? SURE.

THAT'D BE GREAT. WHERE DO WE. WHERE DO WE? BE RIGHT UP HERE.

OKAY. HOW ARE YOU? HOW ARE YOU? HEY .

YES. I HAVEN'T SENT YOU A. I HAVE NOT SENT YOU A CALENDAR HOLD, BUT WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THAT, SO I WILL DO THAT. ALL RIGHT.

MIC] THANK YOU. THIS IS THE. OKAY. BIG SMILES. OH OKAY. WELL THERE'S SOME FLEXIBILITY. SO I'LL TEXT YOU. I MEAN, SATURDAY.

OH, SATURDAY. I GOT YOU. NO PROBLEM. ALL RIGHT.

THANKS, SUE. OKAY. I BELIEVE THAT CONCLUDES ALL OF OUR LISTED AGENDA ITEMS. SO WE'LL NOW HAVE OUR CLOSING PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD.

IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK?

[01:00:01]

[Closed Session Discussion of Appointment, Employment, or Assignment of County Employee, and Authority: 2014 Md. Code, State Government 3-305 (b) (1)]

COMMISSIONER PORTER. AYE. COMMISSIONER BREEDING.

AYE. COMMISSIONER BARTZ. AYE. OKAY. THE AYES HAVE IT UNANIMOUSLY, AND WE WILL NOW TAKE A RECESS.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.